Chris Miller
Robby Incmikoski: Three across. Normally not like that. How about that? Chris Miller, thanks for joining the book.
Chris Miller: Thank you for having me, Robby. It’s [inaudible] honor.
Robby Incmikoski: No, you know what? We’ve spoken to a Bleacher Creature. We’ve spoken to a Baltimore Orioles fan who was at the game when Cal didn’t play—the game the streak broke.
Chris Miller: Oh, okay.
Robby Incmikoski: [Inaudible] there for his last game, so . . .
Chris Miller: That’s kind of cool. And that would also be my luck. I’d get tickets to an Orioles game, and Cal Ripken wouldn’t be playing.
Robby Incmikoski: Right, right. But that’s actually kind of cool to tell that story. So we’ve talked to quite a few—not quite a few, but we’re gonna have about seven or eight fans in the book that are gonna be there from your perspective like you, but you have a special role as a fan with this team, and I only know this because I got to witness it for eleven years, and we became friends. But what is the coolest thing about running and creating and founding the Renegades of the Rotunda? Like, how cool a life experience is that for you, your friends, and those that come up, hang out, drink beers, take pictures with you?
Chris Miller: I never anticipated that it would become what it is—never in a million years did I think we’d be Major League Fan of the Year, we’d get to be doing all the things, we’d get to meet all the people we’ve met, me doing this right now. But it’s, every day is special whenever you do that. Whenever you get to meet and interact with these people at the ballpark, it’s different. Whenever you get to like maybe create an experience for—especially like a kid—something just a little bit different than your normal trip to a ballpark. A lot of the friends I’ve made, a lot of the people who do this, we met doing that. Like a lot of the Renegades are—that’s how we met.
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: They saw us on TV, they’d come out as friend of a friend. Like, “Hey, my buddy might like to do this; my buddy might like to do that.” It’s a unique experience, and again, it’s nothing I ever really expected it to be. But it’s just to be part of somebody’s game-day experience . . . My first opening day was in 1987.
Robby Incmikoski: Okay.
Chris Miller: And I’ve been doing this a very long time. If I can bring—yeah, we’ve talked in the past: Baseball skews older as far as a fan base. I think last year they said the average age of a baseball fan was like fifty-five years old, which is crazy.
Robby Incmikoski: Yep.
Chris Miller: And in basketball, it’s like twenty-six. If we can help usher in a new generation of baseball fans—we can help grow the game—and it’s kind of a way to give back, if nothing else.
Robby Incmikoski: Yeah, no question about that. Now, how did the Renegades of the Rotunda start?
Chris Miller: Well, the joke is, it’s my best bad idea ever.
Robby Incmikoski: Okay.
Chris Miller: And I had this stuff in 2012, and I was wearing it to a couple games. I actually had, it was somebody that I bought something off of on Etsy or one of those sites years before made different pieces for a Pirate costume. Like, “I’ll sell it to you at cost if you get pictures at the ballpark in this stuff.” And this was in early 2012. I’m like, “No big deal, cool.”
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: Then I just kept going. I did that a handful of times that year, and then a little more in ’13. And in ’14, I just kind of threw it out there. I was like, “Does anybody want to do this with me?” Like, doing it alone’s fine, but this is definitely the kind of thing that’s better with friends, with a bigger group of people, and the spectacle of it. Of course, I think fifteen or twenty people showed up, just out of a call.
Robby Incmikoski: All dressed as Pirates?
Chris Miller: Right. Like, “Hey, we’re gonna meet at the baseball game.” I don’t remember the exact date—I probably should.
Robby Incmikoski: That’s all right. Not relevant to the story. But go ahead.
Chris Miller: Right. But just said, “You guys want to meet down here?” And a lot of people showed up. A lot of those people are still doing it. Some folks have moved away, and other folks got married or got jobs, but it’s funny to kind of watch the crew rotate in and out. And you can almost kind of tell like what year it is based on a picture of us, by who’s in it. “Oh, I remember that. That’s before so and so moved, or so-and-so got a new job.
Robby Incmikoski: Did, what kind of, the one thing I’ve noticed is when I’ve been up there, is the amount of kids that walk by and take pictures with you. What is that feeling like when they stop you or like a mom or a dad stops you and says, “Hey, can you take a picture with my son?” and like you give him the sword or like you joke—you know, not that [inaudible] small kid. You know what I mean. Like, you know what I’m saying?
Chris Miller: [Inaudible.]
Robby Incmikoski: You really go out of your way to make their day. You’ve become a little bit of a celebrity at PNC Park in your time here.
Chris Miller: If that’s a way that we can make somebody’s day a little bit better, why not? It was Roberto Clemente said, “If you’re not,” what is it, “If you’re not using . . .?”
Robby Incmikoski: Difference on this earth.
Chris Miller: “If you’re not making a difference,” yeah, “if you’re not using your time to make a difference, you’re wasting your time on this earth.” Why not? Like, why wouldn’t we do it? And one of the things I always try to stress to anybody that wants to be a part of it, or has been a part of it: We’re never too good for anybody.
Robby Incmikoski: Mm-hmm.
Chris Miller: Anybody that comes up, we’ll make time for, we’ll take a picture with. We’re there to be part of the experience. We’re there to be part of the fandom of baseball, more than just the city. But we get a lot of people from out of town that want to take pictures. That’s also a reason why we are where we are—I wanted it to be accessible. I wanted people to be able to find us if they wanted to, and I didn’t want to limit it to seats or anything. Where we are is general admission. Anybody can join—it’s not mine, it’s ours.
Robby Incmikoski: Mm-hmm. When you, which leads me to my next question: You watch the game, you pay attention to the game, and you’re, arguably you might be at the furthest point in the stadium, if I’m not mistaken, from home plate.
Chris Miller: Probably. Yeah, I mean, you’d really have to—
Robby Incmikoski: Maybe that corner seat all the way, like maybe, but I think . . .
Chris Miller: Maybe that corner seat, and maybe like the ones under the Jumbotron maybe, but it’s probably us.
Robby Incmikoski: That’s about it, yeah. I think you guys are probably a little bit higher. But anyways, either way, point is you’re in one of the furthest seats from home plate in the entire building. What’s it like trying to pay attention to the game?
Chris Miller: We have the best view—there’s never anybody in our way. We get to see defensive positionings. We don’t have the, like if somebody hits a fly ball, we’re not just cheering for cheering’s sake. We know basically where it’s going to land. We get the big picture. It’s like at a football game. I like to sit up high in an end zone so I can watch the play develop. You can do that where we are. There’s not a lot of spaces in PNC Park where you can do that because the sightlines are what they are. You know, the stadium’s on the small side. It’s on the intimate side, which is good; I don’t want that to sound like a knock. But I get the big picture.
Robby Incmikoski: When you, another thing I’ve noticed, just from being friends with you, is a lot of people have, and I’m not being flip when I say this. Like a lot of players, former players, coaches whatever—they’ve gotten to know you.
Chris Miller: Mm-hmm.
Robby Incmikoski: Like, they want to know who the most loyal fans are because you’re not a guy who, you don’t ask for like stuff. You know what I mean? Like you’re just a fan . . .
Chris Miller: [Inaudible.]
Robby Incmikoski: I don’t mean just. I’m not demeaning you. You know that. What I mean by that is like you’re a fan in the truest sense, but like that’s, you just want to watch baseball and drink beer. Like, you don’t ask for anything. You don’t ask for autographs. You know, like with me, you know what I’m saying? You never asked me for anything other than to come up and drink a beer or to say hello. You know what I’m saying? So like, how cool is it that like you keep it at a professional level while still being a fan, and you’ve gotten to know a lot of people associated with the team, right?
Chris Miller: I’m still in touch with a number of people.
Robby Incmikoski: Friends with everybody.
Chris Miller: Again, it’s about accessibility. It’s about the game. It’s about the game as a whole more than it is about the game at PNC Park. People have asked me for my autograph, and that’s a weird thing.
Robby Incmikoski: Yeah, for sure.
Chris Miller: We’re not here to, I’m not there to take anything. I’m there to give, if I can. And it’s baseball. And again, I’m also forty years old; I’m not asking some twenty-four-year-old kid for an autograph.
Robby Incmikoski: Right. But hold on. I think you missed the point of my question. My point is like you’ve gotten to know Steve Blass, Kent Tekulve. You’ve gotten to know people associated with the team because of your fandom.
Chris Miller: Trevor Williams . . . Chad Kuhl. I went to Amanda Kuhl’s cancer treatment in northern Virginia last year.
Robby Incmikoski: That’s what I’m saying. That’s what I’m saying. So can you just tell us a little bit about how you’ve been able to develop relationships with those associated with you. Tell me about Amanda Kuhl’s t . . . Tell me about that because I mean, obviously I know what you’re talking about, but fans won’t know.
Chris Miller: Yeah, so, I got to know Amanda . . .
Robby Incmikoski: Quick background: Chad Kuhl’s the former pitcher.
Chris Miller: Correct. Chad . . .
Robby Incmikoski: Former pitcher for the Pirates, drafted and developed, came up through the minor leagues with the team. And then his wife, Amanda, has been battling breast cancer for a couple years. Go ahead.
Chris Miller: Right. That was after she left. That’s when he was pitching with the Nationals, whatever.
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: She had her diagnosis and all that. But I got to know Amanda, like as close as I’ve become with Chad, Amanda was at the games. Chad was at work, so I got to know Amanda better than I got to know him. But going down to see guys like that, it was Trevor Williams and Chad Kuhl played for the Nationals. And I got to go down to spend time with them. Why do people gravitate toward ex-players, broadcasters, sideline guys? I have no idea—I have absolutely no idea. It might be because it’s, I’m not an autograph hound, or some—maybe it's that. I know like players can smell it on somebody whenever they’re there for something like that.
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: I know they don’t love it. But I think it’s just, the environment I try to foster is supposed to be welcoming, like, “We’re all there to enjoy the same thing, and let’s do it together.”
Robby Incmikoski: Right. You still didn’t answer my question: How cool is it to become friends with players and coaches with the team, given your status as a fan? That’s all I’m asking. It’s my third time asking this, and we’re not using anything you just said, other than Amanda Kuhl part. How cool is to become friends with people being as big a fan as you are? That is not normal in baseball.
Chris Miller: It isn’t, and I’ll be honest with you. Again, I don’t know why. It’s, I don’t know why they’ve chosen to do it, but it’s . .
Robby Incmikoski: How cool is it? My question is, How cool is it? That’s the question.
Chris Miller: I’m trying to phrase this.
Robby Incmikoski: Dude, Steve Blass threw two complete games and a no-hitter in 1971. He knows who you are and what you do. How ****ing cool is that?
Chris Miller: [Inaudible.] It’s awesome, man. To be a part of baseball in that way—in a very, very small way—is incredible. It’s something that I’ve been passionate about my entire life, and now that I get to not share it with people, to experience with people, like Hall of Famers, for God’s sake. I was a bartender downtown for many years, and that’s how I got to know a lot of guys on and off the field.
Robby Incmikoski: Right. Now you’re answering the question.
Chris Miller: But it was weird to see guys that would recognize me. Like even guys on other teams like Joey Votto knew who I was. He knew my face and he’d give me shit whenever he was in town just from—I worked just across the bridge. And it’s just ways to foster those relationships. But never in a million years did I think I would be at work, sitting at the bar, chopping up baseball with Joey Votto.
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: Never. My regulars were Francisco Cervelli, John Jaso loved to come in all the time, Josh Bell when he was a Bucco, Jameson Taillon—guys like that who have since left baseball or moved away.
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: But it wasn’t like I was walking in two worlds; nothing really changed. Like, the relationship wasn’t different whether I was at work or I was at the ballpark. But it’s, it gives you a little bit of, I’m trying to think, whenever you look at it like that, you watch these guys on television and they’re superstars, and it’s like they’re playing at the absolute highest level of the sport that we’ve maybe ever seen—like we may be watching the best baseball of all time right now. And just being able to connect with these guys on a personal level is really impressive, and how appreciative they are of that, like just to be treated like anyone else. It’s always a breath of fresh air to see somebody that has achieved like that level of success, and in some cases fame. It’s maybe not necessarily in Pittsburgh. I don’t think anybody as lining up there by Trevor Williams [inaudible].
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: But just to be treated like everyone else.
Robby Incmikoski: That’s what I’m saying. People like and respect you. First time in fifty interviews I’ve had to ask my same question three times.
Chris Miller: Yeah, I know, but that’s not who I am, Robby. I’m not used to being liked or respected. I’m usually not called sir unless somebody [inaudible], “You’re making a scene.”
Robby Incmikoski: Hey, 2013 Wild Card game—we talked to Neil Walker, who played in that game. How do you describe the atmosphere of that night? What did you guys do before that game, during that game, after that game? Just tell me what that night was like.
Chris Miller: To tell you how important that game was to me: I went in street clothes. I didn’t— I went. I was there to sit down. I was there when the gates opened. I was in my seat. I did not leave it the entire time. It felt like something we had earned, as fans.
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: I was young, but I remember what this town was like after Sid Bream. I remember it. And at this part in the Lower Valley, he’s not Sid Bream—he’s “Sid effing Bream.” He has three names up this way.
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: But just to kinda see that pent-up emotion come out of this city—it was like, when Cueto dropped the ball, it was like there were sparks in the air. I’ve never been to any sporting event that had that kind of energy. I don’t know if that’s what you want to call it. But it definitely that kind of, and it felt like physical energy. The stadium was shaking whenever Russ hit the bomb. It was nuts—and everybody went completely insane. From that moment, nobody sat. Everybody was standing in the upper deck from that moment until the last pitch. And when the last pitch was over, everybody cried. Everybody in that section. It was just tears of joy. It was nuts. It was just like, elated.
Chris Miller: And then, after the game, we were down, everybody just kind of dispersed out into the streets. My buddy Mark—who was running the—back when there were still nightclubs in Station Square (I think they’re all condos or some **** now)—comes walking out of Dominic’s with two cases of beer. I was like, “Mark, where the hell did you get this?” He goes, “Don’t worry about it. Just take one.” So we’re on Federal Street, just standing there over cases of beer. Some guy jumped off the bridge; he was splashing around.
Robby Incmikoski: I remember that. I saw that.
Chris Miller: Apparently the guy did get caught. ’Cause I know he like got out of the water. I thought he escaped, but no, eventually they, I guess the guy did get caught. I guess he did get rung up on charges [inaudible]. But the city [inaudible]. And it was, on the way there, ’cause I remember I parked in town, and I went to see the duck—because we had that big stupid rubber duck.
Robby Incmikoski: I remember that duck. I remember it.
Chris Miller: And we called it the Quackin’. We walked across Fort Pitt Bridge, over to—where in the hell was it? [Inaudible[ were there. Whatever those bars were in the breezeway there. One was the Tilted Kilt.
Robby Incmikoski: Yeah. I know what you’re talking about.
Chris Miller: I’m on the phone. My buddy kept saying, “You gotta get down here, man. Everybody’s saying they’ll buy you a beer. I’m wearing a black T-shirt and a black Pirates cap.” Then I looked at my phone. Everybody’s wearing a T-shirt and a black Pirates cap. That’s what [inaudible] said. “We’re blacked out. That’s what we’re doing today.”
Robby Incmikoski: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Chris Miller: “I’m wearing a black T-shirt and a black Pirates cap.” “Yeah, you and a hundred thousand other people, dude.” But you could have walked from the North Shore Drive, we went into the Clemente, no, we went into the Wagner gate. You could have walked on people’s shoulders the whole way and never touched the ground. I’ve never seen a crowd like that.
Robby Incmikoski: Let me ask you this. Neil and I talked about this, and I’m curious. He gave me the player’s perspective; I’m curious from a fan’s perspective now. Let me say this. Let me ask you this. I’ve gotten the player perspective. I’m curious of the fan perspective. What, people, and gain, this book is gonna be national. All thirty cities in baseball, plus Cooperstown and whoever else is a baseball fan in rural America—what did that game—I know the answer to this, so I’m not asking for me—tell people out there. What did that game represent? It was more than just a Wild Card game. How did that game impact baseball in the city of Pittsburgh?
Chris Miller: I mean, it’s, now that I have the benefit of hindsight in terms of, not a hell of lot, other than the fact that we don’t have a One Game Wild Card anymore.
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: But in the city of Pittsburgh, it represented hope. It represented change. We had done it before, and I’m forty years old, so three seasons of winning baseball.
Robby Incmikoski: Right. Yeah
Chris Miller: Thirty-eight. So I’m getting up where I’ve seen three seasons of good baseball. I was around for the early ’90s run, but I was three. It doesn’t f***ing matter. But it meant that, it was that, Pittsburgh is a, we’re blue-collar, we’re gritty. You know, we’re Rust Belt, and that’s my favorite part of the country. I love that. I love all of it, from Rochester to Toledo.
Robby Incmikoski: Yep.
Chris Miller: I love the Rust Belt. I love the people there. But it meant that we could do it too. It was that “why not us?” kind of quality about it. But it was hope—and it was just, we got the monkey off of our back. It was that, just a collective release of all that time spent watching just **** baseball.
Robby Incmikoski: Right. Right.
Chris Miller: Yeah, it was therapy. It was the baseball equivalent of the first beer after you cut the grass.
Robby Incmikoski: Exactly.
Chris Miller: Robby, a guy was so happy he jumped off the bridge in front of the Coast Guard.
Robby Incmikoski: I remember that. I remember. I remember, it’s crazy, man. Like, I remember the, I remember that happening. I remember the guy jumping off, celebrating. Which is crazy. That same bridge, like people want to end their life and they jump off the same bridge. It’s like it’s not gonna end your life, you know?
Chris Miller: Right.
Robby Incmikoski: And he does it after the Wild Card game for fun.
Chris Miller: Right.
Robby Incmikoski: And it’s kind of crazy to see that, see that dichotomy, you know, like something obviously very serious, such as life or death, actual life or death, and then people doing it [inaudible].
Chris Miller: Some dude was just cannonballing off the goddamn bridge.
Robby Incmikoski: Right. Exactly. But now that’s pretty cool man. I mean, by the way, do you remember the first game—were you at Opening Day at PNC Park 2001?
Chris Miller: Mm-hmm. I was at the last game at Three Rivers. I was at the first game—
Robby Incmikoski: We’re only talking about current stadiums, but yeah, that’s amazing, too. You see Wehner make the last error and hit the last homer.
Chris Miller: And hit homer. Did he? Oh yeah, he did have the last error.
Robby Incmikoski: Hit the last error. Or made the last error and hit the last homer. Still f***ing cool not matter how you slice it.
Chris Miller: Yeah, I don’t give a shit. It was awesome—he hit the shit out of that home run. He it that thing on the screws.
Robby Incmikoski: So what do you remember from that day, opening day 2001?
Chris Miller: I actually went to, technically speaking, I went to both ’cause we did to the exhibition series against the Mets.
Robby Incmikoski: We’re not talking about that. Let’s [inaudible] opening day.
Chris Miller: But there was nothing like walking up, and we went in the home plate gate, taking the elevators up, and you get to see the, everything kind of open up in front of you: that view, and you get to see the skyline, and the grass was green, and the lines were crisp. And this was coming off a stadium that had absolutely no view and no grass
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: And almost no infield. But just to see that, and it was that feeling of, “Oh my God, this is a real baseball stadium in Pittsburgh,” and that view was gorgeous, absolutely gorgeous. I remember the sun was out that day, reflecting off the skyline—it's not every opening day that we get to see sunshine. Usually it’s either rain or snow. But it was that feeling of like, “We’re in the club now. This is a baseball stadium.” And I have a soft spot for the old multi-purpose cookie cutters.
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: But this was an honest-to-God ballpark. It felt like going to church.
Robby Incmikoski: Yeah.
Chris Miller: It’s a beautiful setup. Apparently, one of the guys who did it designed part of the Vatican.
Robby Incmikoski: Wait, one of the designers, you said?
Chris Miller: I will find the article. But one of the guys that was working with the architectural firm, ’cause it’s, Greisel is the . . .
Robby Incmikoski: I don’t know.
Chris Miller: I believe is the lead architect. He designed one of the upgrades to the papal suite in the Vatican whenever they redid them, again, in the early 2000s. And the guy’s from like Greensburg or some shit, or at least Pittsburgh. I’ll find the article. But he’s one of like eight people who have been allowed to enter the papal chambers, and he also built PNC Park.
Robby Incmikoski: That is tremendous, number one.
Chris Miller: Right.
Robby Incmikoski: Number two, what is it like for you to be one of the main fans, if not the main fan, in that ballpark—to be one of the main fans in that ballpark first of all, right, number one? And number two, to be one of the main fans of what everybody widely refers—not everybody, but most people—widely refer to as the greatest ballpark in baseball. How special is that?
Chris Miller: It’s an honor. It is. It’s nothing we ever, at least I ever anticipated, but I have to remind myself how fortunate I am to be able to go to that ballpark forty-five times a year. As a season-ticket holder, or pass holder, or whatever the case may be, how fortunate I am that that ballpark’s twenty miles from my house. ’Cause we’ve traveled. We’ve followed the team over the years, gone to a number of different ones, and I’ve been to a lot, and PNC’s the best.
Robby Incmikoski: Yep.
Chris Miller: I’ve been to a lot. I’ve been to a number of different stadiums—I’ve been to a lot, and PNC’s the best. I’ve been to Finley. I’ve been to Wrigley. I’ve been to Dodger Stadium. No, I’m sorry. I haven’t been to Dodger Stadium. I was at Angel Stadium, which I think is like the fourth oldest now, which is wild.
Robby Incmikoski: Right.
Chris Miller: It’s what? Oracle Park now in San Francisco? And that’s a beautiful ballpark. Oakland, the Coliseum. I’ve been to the ones that matter. Old Yankee. PNC Park is special. It’s not every day that societally, we find something we can just nail, and PNC is one of those things where the concepts were almost identical to what we got.
Robby Incmikoski: Got it.
Chris Miller: There’s only a handful of things that we as a people have ever designed that we got right. One’s probably the toilet, the flush toilet, and the second was the milk crate, and the third one is probably PNC Park. That’s the list.
Robby Incmikoski: Awesome. All right, brother.